I need legal advice. - Page 5

TheProphet · 11-21-2008, 04:40 AM

this is where i work

Washington Golf Courses | University Place, WA | Chambers Bay

Relentless · 11-21-2008, 04:50 AM

i'm not a big fan of golf

TheProphet · 11-21-2008, 04:57 AM

Originally Posted by Relentless

i'm not a big fan of golf

haha you would be. It’s a great tool to strengthen your focusing abilities, golf is almost a pure mental sport.

It also helps your balance and touch.

Relentless · 11-21-2008, 05:02 AM

for balance i'll do Thai Chi, for touch, i have smoker

TheProphet · 11-21-2008, 05:32 AM

Ill keep you guys posted on what I do and how they react.

Relentless · 11-21-2008, 06:00 AM

i'm starting my own business soon

Snuggles · 11-21-2008, 02:41 PM

Sorry Prophet sounds like you are screwed. Contracts for independent contractors are written to protect the company in every single way, even if it doesn't seem "fair". Did you even read it?

You got a call from your caddie manager to work and you refused work because you were not available yet you were and you were playing. Playing is a free benefit of the contract like you said, and you used it to get out of work. You have nothing, like KOB said I suggest get another job.

You have every legal right to protest, you can protest anything it's your right. Doesn't mean it will afffect anything.

milesteg · 11-21-2008, 04:00 PM

Hey PRophet,

You're screwed. If you were a hired, taxed, employee you'd have rights with the employment commission in your area. But at BEST all you'd get is an unemployment check for a pitance of what you make.

You could protest...but not on their property. THey'll have you trespassed in under five minutes. What that means is a cop will come out and say "Sir they've asked you to leave, now if you don't leave i'm going to run you in for tresspassing.
Even though it's owned by the county, it's still a business and the manager has rights like a defacto owner to kick ppl off.

Sure you may have a lawsuit for discrimination or contract dispute or even wrongful arrest stemming from your tresspassing....you'll probably lose all 3 lawsuits and end up paying court costs yourself, which depending on how much time it takes could easily be in the thousands.

Now if you protested on public or private property across the street you might be able to avoid an arrest for trespassing.........but.

The company/golf course/county can and will be able to take you to court and SUE you. On the outside looking in there's no way for me to tell if they'd have a case..but if they do then you're buried. Why? Because the ppl from the courthouse, the judges, lawyers, bailiffs all work with the same ppl from the county who over-see the golf course.

Believe me, the county will circle the wagons and anything that CAN be done to you, WILL be done to you.

Also, about poaching the golf course's clients, read over your own contract because you may have some sort of "no-compete" clause within it that says you can't do that.

Basically you have no rights and will accomplish very little by protesting aside from possibly getting yourself arrested and probably getting yourself put on some sort of blacklist so that no other golf courses will want to work with you.

I know you got a raw deal but you're probably going to have to let this one go.

milesteg · 11-21-2008, 04:05 PM

OH and that guy from the prison video, the big mexican guy who's in all the prison movies. That's Danny Trejo and I was actually IN prison with him...in an episode of Monk.

I was an extra but he played this small role, he was literally the coolest actor I've ever met. He talked to EVERYONE it didn't matter who they were. He was 60 years old and rather than take the bus from parking to set, the guy RACED the bus and WON.

It was hilarious, it's cold and raining as we took the bus from parking prolly a half mile to the prison we were filming and there's this hardcore old Mexican guy covered in tats running along the bus. He's awesome. He looks like he's the most evil mother fucker to ever live but he's just a nice, happy guy.

Keelar Squeed · 11-21-2008, 06:49 PM

Originally Posted by TheProphet

I just need to be 100% prepared for everything they might try and be a few steps ahead of them.

Get cousel from a labor/employment attorney. You may be able to get back in if it's handled correctly, and if you make a misstep you could undermine your case.

TheProphet · 11-21-2008, 08:43 PM

Originally Posted by milesteg

Hey PRophet,

You're screwed. If you were a hired, taxed, employee you'd have rights with the employment commission in your area. But at BEST all you'd get is an unemployment check for a pitance of what you make.

You could protest...but not on their property. THey'll have you trespassed in under five minutes. What that means is a cop will come out and say "Sir they've asked you to leave, now if you don't leave i'm going to run you in for tresspassing.
Even though it's owned by the county, it's still a business and the manager has rights like a defacto owner to kick ppl off.

Sure you may have a lawsuit for discrimination or contract dispute or even wrongful arrest stemming from your tresspassing....you'll probably lose all 3 lawsuits and end up paying court costs yourself, which depending on how much time it takes could easily be in the thousands.

Now if you protested on public or private property across the street you might be able to avoid an arrest for trespassing.........but.

The company/golf course/county can and will be able to take you to court and SUE you. On the outside looking in there's no way for me to tell if they'd have a case..but if they do then you're buried. Why? Because the ppl from the courthouse, the judges, lawyers, bailiffs all work with the same ppl from the county who over-see the golf course.

Believe me, the county will circle the wagons and anything that CAN be done to you, WILL be done to you.

Also, about poaching the golf course's clients, read over your own contract because you may have some sort of "no-compete" clause within it that says you can't do that.

Basically you have no rights and will accomplish very little by protesting aside from possibly getting yourself arrested and probably getting yourself put on some sort of blacklist so that no other golf courses will want to work with you.

I know you got a raw deal but you're probably going to have to let this one go.

Thanks man and that’s sorta what I have been think to but I allso have another approach.
Now I don’t think they could even classify me or any of the other caddies as independent contractors with the way the treat and regulate us so much. And there has been people trying to contact the caddies to help them get that fixed but the management told every one not to pay attention to that and if they did they would have to start paying taxes on their tips, so no one would.

So do I have a case if from the get go I was wrongfully classified as a independent contractor? If I started to rock the boat with the right people would the course avoid a audit at all costs? Seeing how they would have to pay a lot of back taxes? What do you think?

TheProphet · 11-21-2008, 08:49 PM

Originally Posted by Snuggles

Sorry Prophet sounds like you are screwed. Contracts for independent contractors are written to protect the company in every single way, even if it doesn't seem "fair". Did you even read it?

You got a call from your caddie manager to work and you refused work because you were not available yet you were and you were playing. Playing is a free benefit of the contract like you said, and you used it to get out of work. You have nothing, like KOB said I suggest get another job.

You have every legal right to protest, you can protest anything it's your right. Doesn't mean it will afffect anything.

no i did not get a call i was at the course about to tee off and he yield over to have me come work…. While he had a lot of other people that could have done the job, he just wanted me to do it and I was not in the mood. I was basically demonstrating my right as a independent contractor and he said fuck that then you’re out…

its simply this they want use to be “independent contractors” for the benefit of not paying the taxes and all the things that go with employees but want the power to treat us like employees… im damn sure that is against the law….

Snuggles · 11-21-2008, 09:03 PM

Independent contractors have less rights than normal employees do, they can release you simply because they aren't satisfied with your services. You haven't verified this, are you or are you not an independent contractor? And just because you are an Independent Contractor doesn't mean you get to decide when you work. Well you can, and that's the reason they terminated you, because it's well within their rights. They hired you to provide a service to their clients. If they are not satisfied for any reason they can release you of your services.

Let's say I own a restaurant, and I hired an contractor to provide a valet service to my clients. And part of that contract lets them eat for free. Now if a customer came up and asked to be parked and you were inside eating and I asked you to do it and you refuse because "your not in the mood", I would release you to.

TheProphet · 11-21-2008, 09:10 PM

Originally Posted by Snuggles

Independent iontractors have less rights than normal employees do. You haven't verified this, are you or are you not an independent iontractor? And just because you are an Independent Contractor doesn't mean you get to decide when you work. Well you can, and that's the reason they terminated you, because it's well within their rights. They hired you to provide a service to their clients. If they are not satisfied for any reason they can release you of your services.

Let's say I own a restaurant, and I hired an contractor to provide a valet service to my clients. And part of that contract lets them eat for free. Now if a customer came up and asked to be parked and you were inside eating and I asked you to do it and you refuse because "your not in the mood", I would release you to.

i was not the only caddie there to do the job. its about whats right and whats wrong... and the fact that the caddies there are more likely then not wrongfully classified as a independent contractors so that the course does not have to pay a lot of money that they would if we were employees…

Snuggles · 11-21-2008, 09:17 PM

Just because others were there doesn't make a difference. They asked you and you refused, that's all that matters. The fact is that you were not wrongfully terminated.

Now if you want to look into whether they are using the caddies to avoid paying taxes, that's a different story. However to me it seems that they weren't doing anything wrong.

11-21-2008, 04:50 AM	#62
Relentless Future Convicted Rapist Tetris Champion! Super Flash Mario Bros Champion! Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Port St. Lucie, Florida/West Milford, New Jersey Age: 19 Posts: 18,549	i'm not a big fan of golf __________________ Favorite Fighters - Anderson Silva / Quinton Jackson / Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira / Thiago Alves / Georges St. Pierre / BJ Penn / Brock Lesnar / Dustin Hazelett / Sean Sherk / Junior dos Santos / Nate Marquardt / The Miller Brothers / Killa B / Ryan Bader / Wilson Gouveia At Cameldog, we're not racist We hate everyone equally. Iron Horse Mixed Martial Arts American Top Team *Believe in the Power of One* *R.I.P Evan Tanner*

11-21-2008, 05:02 AM	#64
Relentless Future Convicted Rapist Tetris Champion! Super Flash Mario Bros Champion! Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Port St. Lucie, Florida/West Milford, New Jersey Age: 19 Posts: 18,549	for balance i'll do Thai Chi, for touch, i have smoker __________________ Favorite Fighters - Anderson Silva / Quinton Jackson / Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira / Thiago Alves / Georges St. Pierre / BJ Penn / Brock Lesnar / Dustin Hazelett / Sean Sherk / Junior dos Santos / Nate Marquardt / The Miller Brothers / Killa B / Ryan Bader / Wilson Gouveia At Cameldog, we're not racist We hate everyone equally. Iron Horse Mixed Martial Arts American Top Team *Believe in the Power of One* *R.I.P Evan Tanner*

11-21-2008, 06:00 AM	#66
Relentless Future Convicted Rapist Tetris Champion! Super Flash Mario Bros Champion! Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Port St. Lucie, Florida/West Milford, New Jersey Age: 19 Posts: 18,549	i'm starting my own business soon __________________ Favorite Fighters - Anderson Silva / Quinton Jackson / Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira / Thiago Alves / Georges St. Pierre / BJ Penn / Brock Lesnar / Dustin Hazelett / Sean Sherk / Junior dos Santos / Nate Marquardt / The Miller Brothers / Killa B / Ryan Bader / Wilson Gouveia At Cameldog, we're not racist We hate everyone equally. Iron Horse Mixed Martial Arts American Top Team *Believe in the Power of One* *R.I.P Evan Tanner*

11-21-2008, 04:00 PM	#68
milesteg Lemming Join Date: Jun 2008 Age: 30 Posts: 1,045	Hey PRophet, You're screwed. If you were a hired, taxed, employee you'd have rights with the employment commission in your area. But at BEST all you'd get is an unemployment check for a pitance of what you make. You could protest...but not on their property. THey'll have you trespassed in under five minutes. What that means is a cop will come out and say "Sir they've asked you to leave, now if you don't leave i'm going to run you in for tresspassing. Even though it's owned by the county, it's still a business and the manager has rights like a defacto owner to kick ppl off. Sure you may have a lawsuit for discrimination or contract dispute or even wrongful arrest stemming from your tresspassing....you'll probably lose all 3 lawsuits and end up paying court costs yourself, which depending on how much time it takes could easily be in the thousands. Now if you protested on public or private property across the street you might be able to avoid an arrest for trespassing.........but. The company/golf course/county can and will be able to take you to court and SUE you. On the outside looking in there's no way for me to tell if they'd have a case..but if they do then you're buried. Why? Because the ppl from the courthouse, the judges, lawyers, bailiffs all work with the same ppl from the county who over-see the golf course. Believe me, the county will circle the wagons and anything that CAN be done to you, WILL be done to you. Also, about poaching the golf course's clients, read over your own contract because you may have some sort of "no-compete" clause within it that says you can't do that. Basically you have no rights and will accomplish very little by protesting aside from possibly getting yourself arrested and probably getting yourself put on some sort of blacklist so that no other golf courses will want to work with you. I know you got a raw deal but you're probably going to have to let this one go. __________________ Casual Fans Suck.

11-21-2008, 04:05 PM	#69
milesteg Lemming Join Date: Jun 2008 Age: 30 Posts: 1,045	OH and that guy from the prison video, the big mexican guy who's in all the prison movies. That's Danny Trejo and I was actually IN prison with him...in an episode of Monk. I was an extra but he played this small role, he was literally the coolest actor I've ever met. He talked to EVERYONE it didn't matter who they were. He was 60 years old and rather than take the bus from parking to set, the guy RACED the bus and WON. It was hilarious, it's cold and raining as we took the bus from parking prolly a half mile to the prison we were filming and there's this hardcore old Mexican guy covered in tats running along the bus. He's awesome. He looks like he's the most evil mother fucker to ever live but he's just a nice, happy guy. __________________ Casual Fans Suck.

11-21-2008, 04:40 AM	#61
TheProphet Goomba Join Date: Nov 2008 Age: 25 Posts: 115	this is where i work Washington Golf Courses \| University Place, WA \| Chambers Bay

11-21-2008, 05:32 AM	#65
TheProphet Goomba Join Date: Nov 2008 Age: 25 Posts: 115	Ill keep you guys posted on what I do and how they react.

11-21-2008, 02:41 PM	#67
Snuggles Lemming Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Houston Posts: 984	Sorry Prophet sounds like you are screwed. Contracts for independent contractors are written to protect the company in every single way, even if it doesn't seem "fair". Did you even read it? You got a call from your caddie manager to work and you refused work because you were not available yet you were and you were playing. Playing is a free benefit of the contract like you said, and you used it to get out of work. You have nothing, like KOB said I suggest get another job. You have every legal right to protest, you can protest anything it's your right. Doesn't mean it will afffect anything.

11-21-2008, 09:03 PM	#73
Snuggles Lemming Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Houston Posts: 984	Independent contractors have less rights than normal employees do, they can release you simply because they aren't satisfied with your services. You haven't verified this, are you or are you not an independent contractor? And just because you are an Independent Contractor doesn't mean you get to decide when you work. Well you can, and that's the reason they terminated you, because it's well within their rights. They hired you to provide a service to their clients. If they are not satisfied for any reason they can release you of your services. Let's say I own a restaurant, and I hired an contractor to provide a valet service to my clients. And part of that contract lets them eat for free. Now if a customer came up and asked to be parked and you were inside eating and I asked you to do it and you refuse because "your not in the mood", I would release you to. Last edited by Snuggles; 11-21-2008 at 09:08 PM.

11-21-2008, 09:17 PM	#75
Snuggles Lemming Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Houston Posts: 984	Just because others were there doesn't make a difference. They asked you and you refused, that's all that matters. The fact is that you were not wrongfully terminated. Now if you want to look into whether they are using the caddies to avoid paying taxes, that's a different story. However to me it seems that they weren't doing anything wrong.

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